Author Topic: Scheduled transactions  (Read 2742 times)

Offline Alex

Scheduled transactions
« on: December 07, 2016, 09:00:53 PM »
So I'm creating this thread to get feedback on scheduled transactions.

A couple things:

 1) What recurrence types are import to you? Things like "the last Saturday of every month"? Outlook's recurrences I heard somewhere? Does this tool cover all of your recurrence use cases?

 2) Financier can, by nature, have the same budget on two different computers. Imagine that you open the budget on two different, offline computers separately with the same scheduled transaction and a new transaction appears in the register in each computer. When you sync the budget data on both computers, should you get both transactions (duplicates -- don't try to replace one with the other)? Should one overwrite the other, with precedent to the 'approved' scheduled transaction (if one is approved and one is not)? If one is disapproved (deleted) and the other is approved, should the approved one take over? If one is not approved and the other is disapproved, should the disapproved one take over and you effectively don't see either?

Obviously there are a lot of edge cases here. :) What I want to avoid is if you have a scheduled transaction on one device you use a lot working great, and then you open a very old version of your budget on another device which then creates scheduled transactions and then doesn't intelligently merge them when you sync that budget.

Hopefully that makes sense! Please comment!
I am the Financier owner/admin/coder dude.

Offline ottyacat

Re: Scheduled transactions
« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2016, 09:33:38 PM »
So I'm creating this thread to get feedback on scheduled transactions.

A couple things:

 1) What recurrence types are import to you? Things like "the last Saturday of every month"? Outlook's recurrences I heard somewhere? Does this tool cover all of your recurrence use cases?

I only use the basic ones, monthly, every other week, once off so that tool well and truly covers it for me.

2) Financier can, by nature, have the same budget on two different computers. Imagine that you open the budget on two different, offline computers separately with the same scheduled transaction and a new transaction appears in the register in each computer. When you sync the budget data on both computers, should you get both transactions (duplicates -- don't try to replace one with the other)?

No duplicates please.

Should one overwrite the other, with precedent to the 'approved' scheduled transaction (if one is approved and one is not)? If one is disapproved (deleted) and the other is approved, should the approved one take over? If one is not approved and the other is disapproved, should the disapproved one take over and you effectively don't see either?

I like the logic here, this would all work well for me.

Offline MacMichael

Re: Scheduled transactions
« Reply #2 on: December 07, 2016, 09:47:31 PM »
Is there a timestamp associated with the creation of a scheduled transaction?  If so, wouldn't the last transaction creation date/time take priority on "duplicates"?

Offline athikalaka

Re: Scheduled transactions
« Reply #3 on: December 07, 2016, 09:59:23 PM »
I use the basic ones as well:

1) Weekly, Fortnightly (every other week), Monthly, Quarterly, Bi-Annually, Annually.
This is sufficient but some banks have the 'Last day of the month' or 'Last working day of the month'. I'm not too fussed by it, I just adjust manually when the time comes.
If you want to be tricky and have a toggle switch to say if the expected date (15th of each month) lands on a weekend, then bring the date earlier or later to the working day.
Probably too much effort but the suggestion is there. (I'm happy with the basics)

2) No duplicates

Offline Joel

Re: Scheduled transactions
« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2016, 12:12:21 AM »
Regarding #2, I would not want the scheduled transactions to be duplicated. I would want the software to be smart enough to know which transaction to keep. My concerns relate to making changes to the transaction after it was entered. I wouldn't want those to be overwritten.

Regarding scheduled transaction frequencies, it would really be great if there was a setting that allowed scheduled transactions to be pushed to the previous business day or next business day. I can see a use for both. I would also like to be able to indicate that a scheduled transaction will only last for # of transactions. Those were two of the big things missing with YNAB. With that, I'm going to just indicate the frequencies I have:

- Once (not recurring but still scheduled)
- Every other week
- Twice a month / 15th (or the business day before) and the last business day.
- Twice a month / 4th and 19th (or business days after)
- Monthly on a set date (or the business day after).
- Monthly on the 15th (or the business day before).
- Monthly on the last business day.
- Every other month
- Quarterly on a set date
- Yearly on a set date
- Every other year
- Every 5 years

Other options I don't personally use:
- Daily
- Weekly
- Every 4 weeks
- Every 4 months
- Semi annually

So really, the main improvements to YNAB's options are an ability to move back/forward for the business day closest to and an end date / number of recurrences limit. That's what outlook does great.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2016, 12:20:42 AM by Joel »
Biking and budgeting my way to early retirement!

Ting referral: https://zp8h3m5ceig.ting.com/
Lastpass referral: https://lastpass.com/f?27278462

Offline Joel

Re: Scheduled transactions
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2016, 12:14:54 AM »
So really, the main improvements to YNAB's options are an ability to move back/forward for the business day closest to and an end date / number of recurrences limit. That's what outlook does great.

Looking around at the website you linked, it looks like the business day and end date issues can both be incorporated. Doesn't seem completely user friendly how it's configured on that website, but it seems like it can handle what I want :parrot:
Biking and budgeting my way to early retirement!

Ting referral: https://zp8h3m5ceig.ting.com/
Lastpass referral: https://lastpass.com/f?27278462

Offline Paul

Re: Scheduled transactions
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2016, 02:46:50 AM »
I'm pretty basic too - even though I rely very heavily on scheduled transactions to reduce the drudgery of transaction entry - particularly as most of my bill payments are automated and go out electronically.

So:
1) Monthly on a set day
2) Yearly
3) A one off payment

But of course I understand that others may need difference frequency. The majority of people in the UK are paid monthly or 4 weekly and have their bill payments on a monthly cycle.

Offline nolesrule

Re: Scheduled transactions
« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2016, 07:02:29 AM »
I use the following:

Weekly
Every Two Weeks
Every 4 weeks
Every 15th and last day
Monthly
Every 3 months
Yearly

I would love for "or previous business day" to be like a checkbox option when setting the recurrence. The 15th and last day is my paycheck, and it moves around so much because of weekends or holidays. I actually have my paycheck set up as 2 different monthly transactions for my sanity due to the fluctuations, but I would prefer a single entry.

ETA: I would also love to have a number of occurrences set, either by integer or by a calendar end date. Skipping an occurrence should not change the "end date" but would decrement the number of remaining occurrences.

This would make my life easier for things like allowance, where the amount goes up on the first allowance day following a kid's birthday. I'd be able to set up all of them until they move out of the house well in advance. :)
« Last Edit: December 08, 2016, 07:50:07 AM by nolesrule »

Offline Alex

Re: Scheduled transactions
« Reply #8 on: December 08, 2016, 07:41:04 AM »
Is there a timestamp associated with the creation of a scheduled transaction?  If so, wouldn't the last transaction creation date/time take priority on "duplicates"?

That's a great idea, thanks!
I am the Financier owner/admin/coder dude.

Offline RPNnerd

Re: Scheduled transactions
« Reply #9 on: December 08, 2016, 09:12:04 AM »
I use the monthly and the one time on for the most part.

My monthly is sometimes a reminder.

One of my monthly repeating ones is really "deliver on or by" a certain date and I use the ACH delivery method so I manually correct the regularly repeating monthly each month. It takes 3 business days for ACH to take place. I haven't seen a method yet that would make that easier.  If there happens to be a method that'd be great but it is not a deal breaker once scheduling works.

Offline MacMichael

Re: Scheduled transactions
« Reply #10 on: December 08, 2016, 09:46:00 AM »
This may not be on topic but it is related to scheduled transactions.  It would be very helpful to have a checkbox to include or not include the outlflow/inflow amount in the scheduler.  Many of my scheduled transactions have different amounts every month.  The way I currently do it (in that other software) is to flag the transaction if I have manually adjusted the amount in the scheduled transaction.  The downside of this method is the flag remains when the transaction moves to the register.

Offline ColinG

Re: Scheduled transactions
« Reply #11 on: December 08, 2016, 09:49:53 AM »
Once, Weekly, monthly, quarterly, 6 monthly, annually, every 4 weeks.

The 4 week period is important as some salaries and pensions are paid on a 4 weekly basis.  "Once only" is useful so that forward dated transactions can be entered without showing on the statement until due date.

Colin
« Last Edit: December 08, 2016, 09:54:05 AM by ColinG »

Offline Joel

Re: Scheduled transactions
« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2016, 09:54:56 AM »
This may not be on topic but it is related to scheduled transactions.  It would be very helpful to have a checkbox to include or not include the outlflow/inflow amount in the scheduler.  Many of my scheduled transactions have different amounts every month.  The way I currently do it (in that other software) is to flag the transaction if I have manually adjusted the amount in the scheduled transaction.  The downside of this method is the flag remains when the transaction moves to the register.

For the variable amount transactions I have setup for automatic bill pay, I just leave the amount blank. That way I know I need to update it each month.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned so far is the ability to enter a transaction into the register, and the ability to skip a payment. Both of those features are critical.
Biking and budgeting my way to early retirement!

Ting referral: https://zp8h3m5ceig.ting.com/
Lastpass referral: https://lastpass.com/f?27278462

Offline Mike

Re: Scheduled transactions
« Reply #13 on: December 08, 2016, 10:05:15 AM »
Looks like all of my recurrence uses have been mentioned in previous posts.
The list that Joel posted would cover everything for me, especially "Monthly on the last business day".
 
In the Cascade Mountains of Oregon

Offline jenmas

Re: Scheduled transactions
« Reply #14 on: December 08, 2016, 11:16:02 AM »
I think the only issue with a "previous business day" button is can it be customized? From 2012-2015 I lived in a country where the business week was Sunday through Thursday.